Episode 207: Overwhelm to Overflow: Conquer Burnout for a Balanced Life with Corporate Burnout Strategist, Dr. Raushannah “RJ” Verwayne
“There are external factors that can compound what we’re dealing with, but y’all, it really is us, how we view the world, and how we teach people to treat us.” – Dr. Raushannah “RJ” Verwayne
The fear we all have of not being enough, not having enough, or not doing enough—that’s the same fear that overwhelms us into burnout and inaction.
In today’s episode, Erin talks with Dr. Raushannah “RJ” Verwayne about how we already have what it takes to be our highest selves, that our best ideas are downloaded when we rest, and the journaling techniques that allow you to "dump.”
If burnout is something you know a little too well, this is the episode for you.
ICYMI – Your Post-Episode Homework: Identify if you have any signs of burnout in your life or if you notice any signs of burnout in one of your team members' lives. Then really check in with that employee, “Hey, you didn't show up as much today in our meeting. Are you doing okay?” And really listen to that answer.
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Erin Diehl is the founder and Chief “Yes, And” officer of improve it! and host of the improve it! Podcast. She’s a performer, facilitator and professional risk-taker who lives by the mantra, “get comfortable with the uncomfortable.” Through a series of unrelated dares, Erin has created improve it!, a unique professional development company that pushes others to laugh, learn and grow. Her work with clients such as United Airlines, PepsiCo, Groupon, Deloitte, Motorola, Walgreens, and The Obama Foundation earned her the 2014 Chicago RedEye Big Idea Award and has nominated her for the 2015-2019 Chicago Innovations Award.
This graduate from Clemson University is a former experiential marketing and recruiting professional as well as a veteran improviser from the top improvisational training programs in Chicago, including The Second City, i.O. Theater, and The Annoyance Theatre.
When she is not playing pretend or facilitating, she enjoys running and beach dates with her husband and son, and their eight-pound toy poodle, BIGG Diehl.
You can follow the failed it! podcast on Instagram @learntoimproveit and facebook, and you can follow Erin personally on Instagram @keepinitrealdiehl here. You can also check out improve it! and how we can help your organization at www.learntoimproveit.com. We can’t wait to connect with you online!
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Episode 207 Transcription
Dr. RJ (00:00):
I would say we weren't and we aren't working at home. We're living at work. That's the problem.
Erin (00:05):
Oh my God.
Dr. RJ (00:07):
Yeah.
Erin (00:08):
I'm gonna take that in for a minute. Let me have a moment with that one.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Improve It.
Erin (00:27):
Improve it! Podcast.
Erin (00:33):
Hello everyone. I am Erin Diehl on paper, I'm the founder and c e o of Improve It. I'm an improv comedy expert in a top 1% podcast host. That's right. This show, the Improve It Podcast. I'm also a first time author and keynote speaker. But on soul, I'm a mom. I'm a recovering perfectionist, turn failfluencer. And I'm your new director because every day of your life is an improv scene. So if you're new to this show, welcome. If you are already an improve it Peep, welcome to version 4.0 of this podcast. I am so happy to have you back. Now I wanna get into a couple of housekeeping items before we get into today's episode. Today's episode is fire, first and foremost, my new book. And here it's the title is I See You, A Leader's Guide to Energizing Your Team Through Radical Empathy is now available for pre-order.
Erin (01:38):
You can find it on Amazon, you can find it on Barnes and Noble. We will put the links in the show notes here, and pretty soon we are going to have an awesome new website to share with you. This will give you a free gift with pre-order purchase. It is a one hour workshop with yours, truly. It's called Radical Empathy, and it's built as a partner to this book and it is absolutely free when you pre-order a copy of the book. It is a high ticket valued item and it will only be free when you pre-order the book. So stay tuned for more information on that in the next few weeks. Second, if you have not gotten your wellness workbook yet, this is a freebie for you, please grab it before it's gone. A link to that is in the show notes. It's a free guide that gives you energy boosters, intangible activities rooted in improv to expand your wellness.
Erin (02:42):
You can check that out and the link in the show notes to get yours, because we are going to be going away and bringing in a completely new guide soon. I wanna make sure you get your hands on this. It is literally a 23 page P D f. It should be an ebook. I'm just telling you, it's amazing. It was made by Nicole and my team and myself, and it is absolutely incredible. And it gives you energy boosters, it gives you daily rituals, it gives you activities that you can implement for yourself and for your team, all rooted in play to make you more aware of your overall wellness. So also, this is last stay tuned because with the pre-order of the book, we're also launching a meditation album that is built in conjunction with the book, but it has amazing meditations for you that will help you in your day-to-day as a professional.
Erin (03:39):
So, so many new exciting things coming and I wanna make sure that you my Improve It Peeps, hear all about it first. Sounds like a lot, right? Well, it is. And let me just tell you, I learned a lot about Excessiveness this year, and that's why I am so happy to introduce you to today's guest corporate burnout strategist, Dr. Rashana RJ Ver Wayne. Now, Dr. RJ also known is Well she is, Dr. RJ is a licensed clinical psychologist and the founder of Standard of Care Psych Psychological Services in Atlanta. Dr. RJ integrates self-care with education of the brain and body connection, and explains neuroscience in a relatable manner, whether it's speaking at a woman's conference, hosting a corporate retreat, or attending a grassroots community service event. Dr. RJ is passionate about wellness and self-care. Her latest endeavor focuses on helping black women executives and physicians eliminate burnout, anxiety, and stress.
Erin (04:43):
Now, Dr. RJ is the go-to professional for any and all topics pertaining to mental health. She has appeared as the expert psychologist on the Lifetime Series Killer Kids. The Oxygen Network series Snapped Behind bars and on several episodes of the Docu Crime series for my man on TV one, she's the host of Wellness Wednesdays for K P R S, hot 1 0 3 Jams in Kansas City, and his authored several blogs and articles for a variety of publications. Get ready because today is filled with so many juicy chicken nuggets all about beating burnout. Let's improve it with Dr. Rj.
Erin (05:24):
Okay, welcome to the Improve It Podcast, Dr. Rj, I'm so excited that you are here. Thank you for being here. It's such a pleasure to be here with you. Thanks for having me. Oh my God. Well, we found you online and I was like, must talk to her because <laugh>, you fit in beautifully for the theme of this month. And this is airing in October. Our theme is radical Rest. And as a burnout expert, you are the perfect person to come on and help our team and our improve at peeps. Just really lean into this fact that rest is productive. It really is. Yes. Okay. So in that vein, I would love to set an intention for this show. So what is one word that you would like to not only just talk about, speak about, but give our audience
Dr. RJ (06:19):
Oh, one word. That's really good, Erin. How about enough? Woo.
Erin (06:26):
It's like you're in my brain and in my journal. Yep. Because that is where I'm at. I'm learning that that is enough, is enough. So I love this. This is gonna guide us through. Yes. So again, having you on the show is a dream. And I say that with love because I want to dream more. I want to get more rest, <laugh> and I wanna beat burnout before it starts, as I know so many of our listeners do too. So I wanna start with you. What brought you here? What brought you to this field of burnout or preventing burnout?
Dr. RJ (07:04):
Yes. By trade, I'm a licensed clinical psychologist and I noticed I've been practicing for 16, 17 years and I noticed in my private practice that as I was working with executives, leaders, you know, physicians, attorneys everyone was like depressed and anxious and there was an ongoing repetitive theme of being exhausted. And obviously, you know, I have the privilege and the honor of hearing some very personal stories. And it was at a level that was alarming. And so my thought was, okay, I'm a licensed clinical psychologist, but that limits me to Georgia. I'm licensed to practice in Georgia. It limits me. And I wanted to make sure that I have the capability to reach professionals globally in order to tackle this issue.
Erin (07:53):
I love it. And we need you. And that, that frustrates me so much about therapists. I have family members who are therapists and they're like, I can't talk to such and such 'cause they're in a different state. I love that you found a way to get around it and bring this message to so many more people. What yes, does radical rest mean to you? When you think of radical rest, what does that mean to you?
Dr. RJ (08:19):
When I think of radical rest, I think of operating at our highest self, right? We can't operate if our, at our highest self, if we're exhausted, or if we are pulled into many directions. And so I think about rest, mental, rest, spiritual, rest, physical rest, creative, rest, all, all of the rest combined into one. When I think of radical rest,
Erin (08:45):
Me too. Oh my God, you just named like, I, like when you talked about it, I felt my body just relaxed. Isn't that crazy? Like you can feel your energy shift even when you talk about it, because Absolutely. I'll just say from my own experience, I did, I resisted rest for 20 years. I'm 40. Okay? So for 20 years of my career, 18 years, whatever, I was like, rest is lazy. Rest is, I'm not productive, I'm not achieving. And then that caught up to me in a very big way. So I love that you talk about it changing your mind, body, spirit, all of the things. And I think what happens with executives, with people in corporate America is we sometimes find this, this lack of rest in our bodies and we don't know what to do. And we call it stress or we call it burnout. But there is a difference between the two. What is the biggest difference between stress and burnout?
Dr. RJ (09:52):
The difference between stress and burnout? Stress is, is more you'll feel anxious with stress, anxious, unable to rest, having to stay on the go. It's like on your day off, you're still working or cleaning your house. And there's this internal restlessness that eventually impacts our bodies. Physically. Burnout is a, is a more permanent emotional state. So with burnout, you'll feel depression, hopelessness, exhaustion. And in the psychology world, we called it, we call it anhedonia. And it's like an inability to recharge. My iPhone right now probably needs to be recharged. And you know, if you, if the battery goes too too long, it takes forever. It has to reload, it has to boot, boot up. That's what burnout is like. It's a long process to get back to yourself. Stress is is more of a temporary process of how you interpret or, or how your body deals with the stressors that are coming towards you.
Erin (10:56):
That makes total sense. So you're saying too, when we feel stressed long enough, that could lead, that leads to burnout, but burnout and stress are not the same thing.
Dr. RJ (11:08):
Absolutely. So stress can be a symptom of burnout or, or like you said, a buildup of untreated stress can lead to burnout, but they, they're first cousins, stress and burnout, but they're not the same. And one way to, again, to figure it out, stress is more if we wanna parro it, stress is more the on the anxiety side and burnout is more on the depression side.
Erin (11:31):
Yeah. So just on, and this is just a random question that I thought of as you were talking. How, what is the longest period that you've seen somebody experience burnout? What's the shortest period of time you've seen what somebody experienced? Burnout.
Dr. RJ (11:47):
I've seen burnout the experience for maybe 11 or 12 years at the max before this particular e executive kind of reached their, their point and the shortest amount of time has been like a year. So it takes a while to build up, it creeps up on you and then it's like, bam, like, oh, I can't get up. Or, or getting up. And you're like, this is not worth it. What am I even doing? Why did I work so hard to get here? It's not what I thought it would be. So that can happen in a short of, of a period of time as a year. But it can also linger on. Now, something that determines the amount of time is that the other stressors in our lives and our support systems, and I'm sure we'll probably get to that, but our protective factors can be friends, family, socialization, diet, exercise, all of the other things.
Erin (12:42):
Yeah. What are some of the triggers that, or some of the warning signs, I should say, for people who might be close to, but they're like, I don't know, maybe I'm in burnout, maybe I'm not burned out. What are some things they should look out for as a warning sign?
Dr. RJ (12:57):
Cynicism. And, and so cynicism, like anytime someone gives an idea at work, you're like, that ain't gonna work. That's stupid. <Laugh> right in your head. Yeah. Or you're like, or it's a here we go again. Or they don't really care. Or this is just another thing to check off, a checkbox to do. And I'm speaking of leaders, right? So leaders have have more bandwidth and leeway to make change. Yeah. And when you're a leader and you're feeling like, whatever, who caress? Oh, well that's a sure fire sign of burnout. The cynicism piece. Another sign of burnout is feeling like you have no purpose. And so most leaders, I'll say all leaders have worked really hard to get to where they are. You know, you go to school for all this time and, and pass all these tests and interview and and network, and you get there and you're like am I even good enough? Am I even making a change? Do they even see me? All of that is related to burnout.
Erin (14:03):
Hmm. Hmm. Oh my god. That is, that hits, that hits, that hits. I mean, I think anyone listening right now can think of a time in their life. Maybe it's not right now, but maybe earlier in your career when you have felt that, when you said cynicism, I was like dead giveaway. Because I remember early in my career having a job that sucked my soul. And I was like, oh, everything felt so arduous. It felt like it was like an email felt like I was writing a book. Like it was just, it was, it was a very tumultuous time internally. And I didn't like anything that was happening because it felt so overwhelming. Okay. That makes total sense. Okay. So we know the difference between stress and burnout, but what is the, the difference, difference between, because you mentioned that anxiety is a form of stress, but is there a difference between stress and anxiety? And let me tell you, I even have anxiety asking this question. My armpits are sweating. So is there a difference? And what is it?
Dr. RJ (15:06):
Yes. So stress is our body's reaction to a stressor, right? And so often, some, some, so something that might make you feel stressed might not make me feel stressed and vice versa. It's our body's reaction. So it's the armpits sweating, that's stress. It's the pupils dilating. It's our, our heart beating faster. It's our, our glucose being dumped into our system in the middle of the night, which is why we're up at 3:00 AM and we can't sleep. So that is stress. It's a physical reaction, a bodily response to things that are happening in our environment. The reason I want to, or our interpretation of what's happening in our environment. And I wanna clarify that because that then lends to how to fix it, right? There is a way to fix it. Now, anxiety is more about doubt and worrying about the future. Anxiety is all the what ifs, what ifs, what ifs. So if we think about anxiety of speaking on a stage, what if I fall? What if I forget what I'm gonna say? What if they think that I don't know what I'm talking about? So that's more of, of anxiety if you can think about all the what ifs in the world.
Erin (16:23):
Yeah. Oh, that makes so much sense. Okay. I'm loving these clarifying questions just because I, it, a lot of people don't have awareness of the differences. And I think bringing awareness is the first step. And then when we can actually recognize, oh, I'm freaking out about the future, that's my anxiety. That's a great first step. So let me ask you this. Absolutely. This, I, okay, I wanna make sure that I'm on the right page. 'cause I, I mean, these questions are helpful to me. All right. Sometimes we ask questions for the improvement piece, but these are also selfishly helping me. Okay. So let me ask you this. When you see burnout in the workplace, what are some of the causes besides, I mean, we talked about some of the signals, but what can cause burnout? And what have you seen in your work that is a work-related cause of burnout?
Dr. RJ (17:20):
So, I'll, I'll tell you this. Early on I thought that burnout was caused by systems caused by bosses who didn't care, caused by, you know, external things. And I, I was in a few positions, like a clinical director of an agency early on in my career, and I'm like, these people crazy. They're trying to burn me out, so I'm leaving, right? Yeah. And I went to another place clinical director, same thing was happening. And I'm like, you know what? I'm just gonna start my own private practice. I can't be under these conditions. Yeah. And I started my own private practice and guess what happened? The same thing. Mm-Hmm. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, it was me. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, right? It was me who was the problem. And yes, the, the, there are external factors that can compound what we're dealing with, but y'all, it really is us and how we view the world, how we teach people to treat us, how we feel if we are enough and what we do about that. Those are the main causes of burnout.
Erin (18:26):
Oh my god. Way to drop in the intention, Dr. Rj. Okay. So let's talk about that, that feeling of enough, because it really is an internal job. You can hire psychologists, therapists, coaches, mentors, and they'll guide you. But it takes the inner job, the inner work of your own mind to really change, right? So what, what are some ways that we could tell ourselves we are enough? And, and tell me when you set that intention too, the thought behind it,
Dr. RJ (19:02):
Ways that we can tell our, well, I'll start here. The thought behind it was, what is a common denominator with all the companies I work with, all the executives globally, what's one thing that keeps coming up? And it really is this fear of, am I enough? Am I doing enough? Am I being enough? Is my presence enough? Am I here enough? Am I working hard enough? Everything is enough. And one way to deal with that is to just declare that you are enough. Like we are, we already have what it takes to be our hou highest selves inside. And we have to nurture and develop those things. Journaling and quiet time are my, my, it's my North star journaling is my North Star. I journal twice a day in a five minute journal and set intentions every day and, and affirm myself every day. Now, I don't wanna go on this long tangent, right? Because I can get into this and talk nonstop, but I'll say really quickly,
Erin (20:07):
I'm here for it. I love it. <Laugh>,
Dr. RJ (20:09):
Keep going, keep going. Affirmation. Okay. Okay. I got the green light, so I'm excited. So affirmations I think are important for everyone. Now, I'm a science girl, right? I'm all about the brain. I'm a neuroscience nerd. But there is a place for spiritual work, for emotional work. It all goes together. There's science behind affirmations. Our brain lights up when we say I am enough. We create new neural pathways, which will then bring in opportunities to us to match what it is we are declaring and affirming. They're like, the brain likes it, right? And so saying every single day, I'm enough. Even if you don't believe it will then make your brain say, Hmm, they keep saying this. Maybe I should do something about it.
Dr. RJ (21:04):
It's like, you know, like when you buy a new car let's say you, you buy a new red car that you've never seen before, and you get on the highway and you see your red car all the time, it's like, oh, your brain is now taking notice to the things that are right in front of you. And so it will pull in examples and situations of you being enough. So that's how it works,
Erin (21:29):
Man. Okay, look, I got, I have my notepad, which is also my journal right here. 'cause I use this little paper to take notes. I am a journaler too, and I totally believe in the power of affirmations. Can I, can I ask you a personal question? If you're willing to share? Yes. Like, what is your journal practice? Do you do affirmations? Do you free write? Tell me about that.
Dr. RJ (21:52):
Oh, so it depends on what's happening now. Every single day I do twice a day. I do the five minute journal. And so it's, I think it's by like, so it's in, in the journal. It's what would make today great. And then it has affirmations. I am and actually I have it right here. So lemme just tell you the prompts. Mm-Hmm. So every day I'm, I'm grateful for, how could I forget gratitude? Oh my goodness. Yeah. I'm grateful for what would make today great at daily affirmation so that I am and then at night, three amazing things that happened today. How could I have made it today even better? And I love the word even now. This is, this is the five minute journal. This isn't my, my own journal. And so I do that daily. I also process journal. So if something is on my mind that's when I take out the, the pretty notebook and I just write it all down. I dump on my journal. And then I've recently started doing a shadow journal.
Erin (22:53):
What is that? I'm like,
Dr. RJ (22:55):
That's, that's the next level. Looking at when there are anxieties that won't go away, when there are barriers I can't figure out. I believe that there are childhood thoughts, feelings, and behaviors that have yet to be uncovered. And so the shadow journal is the uncovered part of me. And I just kind of write to her, write to my seven year old self, oh, like what are we doing? What's going on? What are we thinking? That's my newest thing. Now, I don't do all these daily, I do my five minute journal twice a day, no matter what the processing journal and the shadow journaling that happens when I'm feel, when I'm starting to feel overwhelmed or if I'm out of my routine and I'm like, ugh, something isn't right. So
Erin (23:38):
Yep, you're starting to feel that stress or anxiety build up. Oh my God, I love it. I'm so, you don't even know my soul could talk about this all day long. This is, I ha I love this because this is literally what gets me through life. I have to have affirmations, gratitude. I love this shadow journal. Can I just tell you, so I, I have a therapist, you know, who doesn't these days? And we're
Dr. RJ (24:00):
A lot, everybody needs a therapist.
Erin (24:01):
Everyone needs a therapist. But we just started working on E D M R I, what is it? E i desensitization. I can never remember the acronym.
Dr. RJ (24:13):
I just movement. Oh, that's
Erin (24:15):
A good one. Oh my God. We'll Google it. We'll Google it. But E dmr, e d e d M R. And I just yesterday, I, I talked to my 13 year old self in the session and it was incredible. It's, it's so incredible. And you see patterns in your life. And I love that the shadow journaling is very similar to that. Because when we can uncover and recognize when these things start to happen again in our adult lives, we're like, oh, there's that, there's that feeling of abandonment I had when I was 13, creeping up again. There she is. Oh, that's why. Yes. I, I developed chronic pain in my body. 'cause I didn't deal with that abandonment issue. That's why, you know, I'm just so here for your work, and I'm so here for this. And I love that this is a way that we can identify, we can prevent, we can get to know ourselves more because we don't wanna get to this state of burnout, which could last, as you said, for 12 some years.
Erin (25:09):
So thinking of the leaders, okay, listening to the show, because I know there are so many people, leaders out there and they lead people and they leading people is so hard. You're basically, and I, we had another guest recently who just launched today, Simon Ong. And he has a book called Energized. And I'll never forget this quote. He goes, leaders, especially CEOs aren't the chief executive officer, they are the chief energy officer. You're just directing energy, right? So what are some identifying signs that we can see in our employees or team members where there are signs of burnout, their energy has shifted? What are some things that leaders could look out for?
Dr. RJ (25:54):
The first thing would be lack of productivity. So yeah, often when, and, and of course it depends on the indus on the industry, but you may see lack of productivity, careless mistakes, a lot of callouts, a lot of F M L A having to be taken like back to back, to back to back and maybe even isolation. Yeah, that can happen as well. And, and body language. So we're in this virtual space, this virtual world where often cameras are off and, and that sort of thing. But you can look into a team member's eyes and their shoulders down and the shakiness in their voice and know that something isn't right. And so paying attention to body language as leaders is important. And then also patterns of frustration, outbursts avoidance, those types of things.
Erin (26:50):
Okay. I'm gonna dive a little deep on this 'cause I love this. Yes. Let's say you're the leader on Zoom. Let's say I'm the leader. You're the team member. And I noticed today you show up Dr. Rj, and you are just slumped. And your body is kind of just ha you know, you're, you're hanging low, you're not really making eye contact. This lasts for a couple weeks. How do you as a leader, talk to your team member and about burnout or, and, and do it in a way that's effective? Because I'll tell you this, just from a personal experience, when I see that from a team member, and I haven't had this happen in anybody on the Improve IT team, but in a past life I watch this team member. And you know what, as the leader, I selfishly, my ego was like, what am I doing wrong to this person? Why? Why am I, what if, are they mad at me as their leader? Are they people pleaser, recovering, people pleaser? That's what we are. But how do you as the leader not internalize it and take it personally and effectively talk to that team member to help them?
Dr. RJ (28:04):
Oh, that's a great question. And, and it can get complex, which is why I think that the culture of every successful company that who wants to grow and expand should focus on preventing burnout at the start and make it an an open door conversation. Because there's a lot of shame behind burnout. It feels like I'm not enough. Everybody's doing it except for me. Why can't I get this right? So the culture of the company at the very beginning will help shape that. Now, if you're already knee deep in it which a lot of our leaders are, the first thing would be to put on your mask first, right? Mm-Hmm. We hear that a lot now about self-care. Leaders must sleep by example. Leaders have to have a morning routine. Leaders cannot skip their, their exercise and moving their body and, and their own self-care.
Dr. RJ (29:00):
One, your team will mimic that. And it snowballs. And it's like this now, it's this exponential issue of burnout all over the place. And two, when something goes wrong, you'll feel like it's just you because there have been no introspective work. You're exhausted and reactive. That's for leaders. I see that a lot. And so one way a leader then can address this, depending on your company policy, your company culture, you can say, I noticed today you didn't speak up as much. How are you doing? And I mean, really, like asked that question. And obviously there are HR rules and that sort of thing, but listening isn't against the rules, right? Listening is never against the rules. And often leaders are so busy with meetings that the people work that's the most important part gets left out. And so often team members will feel like, well, they're too busy. They don't care. They don't notice. So getting rid of some of the fluff in the schedule for leader in your schedule to make time for your team and space for people work and connection would be one way to deal with it.
Erin (30:18):
I love it. Oh my God, that was extremely helpful. I feel like so many people listening are going, like, I just took notes. We will reiterate that at the end of the show because that was amazing. And it happens in every organization. And I will tell you, especially coming out of the pandemic, crazy amount of burnout happened just by working from home because we all worked ourselves into the ground trying to figuring it out.
Dr. RJ (30:43):
Can I interrupt you, Erin? Yeah. I would say we weren't and we aren't working at home. We're living at work. That's the problem.
Erin (30:50):
Oh my God.
Dr. RJ (30:51):
Yeah.
Erin (30:53):
I'm gonna take that in for a minute. Let me have a moment with that one.
Dr. RJ (30:56):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>.
Erin (30:58):
That's for real. That is for real. Oh my God. You just, you just like stuck a nail right on the head. You went boom, it went right into the board. That is it. That is it. I need a lot. I'm sitting this episode to seven people right now who I can think of. Who needed to hear that hear? That is insane. That's it. And that's really what I think, if you put it in perspective that way. We have to be more and we have to be more intentional with our boundaries, especially technology. My husband and I had this same talk last night. He works from home I, as I do, but he has to travel in the office. He's actually an organizational psychologist. And so he is their their talent development leader globally. So his job is really challenging 'cause he's on Zoom all day, so he needs to be in the office a lot.
Erin (31:47):
But when he gets off Zoom, he then wants to be on his phone at night to catch up on his texts and talk to people that he missed throughout the day. So he's on the phone as most of us are for 12 hours or on a screen for 12 hours of the day. We have no relaxation, there's no step in nature, there's no break. And so that perspective we are living at work shifted so much for me. And I'm sure people listening can really relate to that because there used to be, and most pe some people still go in the office that break when you come home, ah, work is done. Lemme take my bra. There's a career
Dr. RJ (32:28):
Delineation of your, of the end of the day, right? <Laugh>? Yes.
Erin (32:32):
Yeah. And I'm saying, let me take my bra off at the end of that day, I would work in the office. I don't even wear a bra most days working from home. So there's no, no bra to take off. Okay. And like, it's just, there is no delineation. So having clear set intentions is so purposeful. Well, let me, I wanna talk to you about the ways that you apply radical rest to your life. Tell us, because I love your journaling practice. I wrote that down. I'm, I'm gonna do this tonight actually. I love it. And we'll put those in the show notes for everybody too. What are some ways that you take care of yourself? What are some self-care practices that you implement?
Dr. RJ (33:11):
I am relentless about self-care. My brain, Erin is my moneymaker, and so I can't have any issues going on where I'm distracted or forgetting things or there's a lack of concentration. So I schedule my rest just like I schedule my meetings and it, it's like blacked out. There's nothing else that can go there. Even though as a high performer, I have have <laugh> a persistent urge to say, well, I can squeeze this in. I have to say, girl, no. Like, yeah, it's blacked out for a reason. Your brain is your money maker. You have to recharge. And so scheduling rest, and I also sprint and rest. And so what I mean by that, I live my life in quarters. And each quarter is kind of like the average person's year. So I don't do a year, it's too far apart from so much can happen every quarter.
Dr. RJ (34:06):
So right before the quarter, I take a few days off to rest, recharge, and plan for the next quarter. And then I sprint, I go hard, and then I rest again. And so I just got at the time that we're talking, I just returned from a workcation in Belize and which was amazing, and I felt so productive. Like I got the best ideas by the pool, like just yes. And I'm like, oh, I could do do this to improve my client experience and I can do this and do that. The best ideas were downloaded while I was resting. Yes. I mean, our brain needs that permission and the time for creativity for our, our higher selves to, to integrate with our everyday busy selves. So radical rest is scheduling rest, knowing that rest is productivity. It, it is a part of work, it's a part of success, it's a part of high performance. And it's necessary. And also removing the guilt and shame that comes along with resting.
Erin (35:17):
Yes. Okay. Yeah. I have so many questions for you really quickly because we're running out of time. Yes. And this is a very important one. How long is this rest period at the beginning of every quarter? Is it a week? Is it two weeks? Tell me that.
Dr. RJ (35:31):
For me, it's four days. Okay. And so I have, it's, it's just four days. It doesn't have to be anything fancy. It can be, you know, a staycation. It'll be different for everybody. However I also have scheduled time during the week where it's just thinking time only, no electronics. I'm just sitting and thinking, my thinking time is about two hours a week. Some people like to, to divide it into 30 minute segments. I want all of my two hours at once. So Monday mornings I like to ease into my week. And the first part of my day is just thinking time. And so then I'm not dreading Mondays because on Saturday I'm like, yes, I get to just think and relax for the first part of my day and it energizes me just to rest. So your period of rest, your time of rest really depends on your industry, your personality, your own needs, if you're taking care of yourself physically and emotionally. But either way, it has to happen. It has.
Erin (36:33):
How's that happen? Oh my God, I love it. And speaking of it, I have to ask you one final question. Yes. This is the question we ask everyone. Obviously the name of the show is Improve It, that it is that thing that makes you, you, it is your purpose. What is Dr r j's it that you bring to the world?
Dr. RJ (36:56):
Oh my, it is authenticity.
Erin (37:00):
Mm. I love, I love it. But no, it's so true. You're super authentic and you're so, so filled with knowledge. Like this is note after note of amazing juicy chicken nuggets that were taken back with us. So thank you so much for coming on the show. Is there anywhere you wanna direct our audience or improve it peeps? Grab your book, executive Burnout, tell them where they can find you. Where can they get the book? All the thanks.
Dr. RJ (37:30):
Oh, the best place to find me would be at my website. Ask dr rj.com. A sk d r rj.com. I hang out and have a lot of fun on Instagram. So come join me there. That's my playground. And so you get to see all of the sides of me on, on Instagram at ask Dr. Rj also, I have something special for your audience really quickly. Oh
Erin (37:52):
Yes.
Dr. RJ (37:53):
I thought about, ooh, what can I give them to in this short amount of time? Because there's gonna be so much to talk about. So I put together some of the favorite tools. Free. It's free by the way, free tools. And it's called a burnout proof package. They can get it by texting, have it all, all one word, lowercase, have it all to 8 3 3 4, 5 1 4 2 5, 8, totally free. Like, okay, some of all the the favorite tools that everyone can take away from this. Have it all.
Erin (38:22):
I love it. Have it all. And it's a burnout proof package. We will put that in the show notes too. So if you didn't grab it, just check the show links and you will sit, you'll find that amazing text message right there, have it all. And then also how we found you was on Instagram. So follow, do dr. What is it at Dr. Rj? Is that it? Ask, ask a skd. R rj. Ask Dr. Rj. Yeah. Okay. Ask Dr. Rj. We'll put that in the show notes too. That's how we found you because we were looking for a, a rest expert, a burnout expert. And then this is, this is what happened. This is a beautiful, I'm so glad you found me. This has been great. Oh, you're amazing. Well, thank you so much for coming on this show. Let me just tell you, you are enough. This was more than enough information and we are so gifted and so guided today by you and by this amazing message that you are sharing globally. So I'm so glad that you expanded your stage. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thanks for being here.
Erin (39:29):
Okay folks, what a woman. I could talk to Dr. RJ all day. Literally, I did not wanna hang up the phone. I was like, this is a blessing. Thank you for this time. So I wanna give you some tangible homework as you know, I love to do. And that is, I want you to identify if you have any signs of burnout in your life or if you are noticing any signs of burnout in one of your team members' lives. If you're a people leader, which I know a lot of you are listening to this show, identifying those signs such as body language, identifying those signs as being lethargic. And then really check in with that employee as she mentioned, Hey, you didn't show up as as much today on, on our meeting. Are you doing okay? And really listen to that answer is so important.
Erin (40:18):
So that's your homework. Identify any areas of your life where you might be experiencing burnout. And then also look at the people on your team and notice if there are any areas in their lives you're sensing a, a sense of burnout as well. Now, she also mentioned leading by example. And I gotta tell you, that is so true, so true. And I, the book that I wrote I see You is all about leading by example. It's all about giving to yourself first so that you can give to others and attract and magnetize the best people in your life and on your team and, and into your orbit starts with you. It starts with you. So again, if you did not listen to last week's episode, episode 2 0 6 called Four Reasons Why I Took a Sabbatical and Why You Should Too check that out. It is an amazing experience.
Erin (41:11):
It's almost like a blog that I'm talking through on air here for you. But I took a sabbatical very similar to how Dr. RJ schedules that rest right before the beginning of the quarter and it changed my life. So listen to episode 2 0 6. We're gonna be talking all about radical rest the entire month of October. And finally, if today's episode spoke to you, please consider leaving us a five star review on iTunes. Literally, I do a happy dance, as does my amazing team of humans who help produce this show every time we get one of those and we can bring more amazing guests to the show like Dr. RJ just by leaving that simple review. So improve it peeps. You know what I'm going to say? I want you to keep failing. Keep improving because this world needs that very special it that only you can bring. I'll see you next time.
Speaker 3 (42:13):
Improve it.
Erin (42:21):
Improve it.